(0:00:00) I think everyone, regardless of their age, likes choices. So we need to extend this to our students where possible. And what I like about choice is it allows the teachers to scaffold the assignment choices by difficulty level. So this means you’re meeting the needs of your students without having to bring attention to any of learning challenges that some students may have.
(0:00:24) Hi there, I’m Carolyn Wall, your host of the Middle School Cafe podcast, a podcast specifically for secondary ELA teachers looking to close the achievement gap. I’m a 20-year veteran teacher who still loves being in the classroom. Tune in each week as I reflect on my own teaching experience to bring you lesson plans, strategies, and stories that will help you develop your students as readers and writers.
(0:00:49) So grab your notepad, a cup of coffee and join me each week as we dive into all things ELA. Here we go. Hello and welcome to our second episode in the summer series. If you missed last week, be sure to go back and listen because Rachel from Uniquely Upper shared all about how we can use centers and stations to help individualize lessons for students.
(0:01:14) This summer, as you know, I’ve invited several of my teacher friends to join me here on the podcast to share something that they’ve done in the classroom to help improve student engagement. We know that teaching has changed over the past few years, and I do truly believe that we’re better together. So I hope that through this series, you’ll find a new tip or a new strategy or a little nugget of information that will carry you into the new school year. I hope that you’re also participating in the Summer Series Challenge.
(0:01:40) If you haven’t joined it yet, you can find all the details over on my Instagram account, middle school cafe. I have a highlight dedicated to the summer series challenge. So be sure to look for that there. You can grab the challenge board as well as see all the prizes that I’ll be giving away. The challenges are easy and related to both my book release and the guest interviews I’m sharing throughout the summer. I hope that you’ll play along. Let’s jump into today’s episode.
(0:02:05) This week in our series, I’ve asked my friend Christy from Two Peas and a Dog to come and share about student choice. She is just as passionate about providing students with choice as I am, so I was really excited to get to chat with her. I’ve worked with Christy in several different events and collaborations on
(0:02:21) but I’d never actually met her. That’s one of those odd things about having an online business. You work with a lot of people that you don’t really know. So it was really nice to finally get to meet her face-to-face, well, sort of over Zoom, but it was still really nice to get to chat with her. I hope that you’ll enjoy listening to our conversation. Hi, Christy. Thanks so much for being here.
(0:02:42) Thanks so much. I’m so happy to be here. Awesome. Yeah, I have worked with you in the past on like several collaborations that we’ve done together, but I haven’t really had the pleasure of meeting you. So it’s nice to kind of put a face to the name that I see all the time. Can you take a moment and just can tell us a little bit about yourself, your background in education and what you’re currently doing? Okay, perfect. Well, yeah, I’m so excited to be here and to work with you and to put a face to the name. So I’m currently in my 16th year of my career.
(0:03:09) I teach part-time at a middle school near Toronto, Ontario, Canada. And when I’m not teaching, I create resources for teachers to use in their classrooms. Great.
(0:03:20) All right. Well, thank you for being part of our summer series. Really, the summer series is all about providing some tangible things that teachers can do when they are in the classroom. We know that education has changed so much recently. I invite a guest to come on to share what they’re expert in or something that they’re passionate about. So I was really excited when you wanted to come chat about student choice. That is something that I talk about all the time on the podcast. I’m very passionate about this topic.
(0:03:46) But can you tell us why you’re passionate about this and why you wanted to come share about it today? Yeah, so I’m really passionate about student choice. Number one, it’s something that’s really pushed in my district where I teach. And so that’s important to know. But also because I noticed that when students were given choices, their engagement and output increased. So for example, if I had my students write an essay, but they could choose their topic, they were more likely to complete that task.
(0:04:15) I think everyone, regardless of their age, likes choices. So we need to extend this to our students where possible. And what I like about choice is it allows the teachers to scaffold the assignment choices by difficulty level. So this means you’re meeting the needs of your students without having to bring attention to any of learning challenges that some students may have. So I’m going to talk about choice boards later.
(0:04:39) But on a choice board, you can have like high, medium and low tasks so that all students are able to complete the work. I love that. Yeah. So what do you see? You kind of mentioned that providing choices for students increases their engagement. Can you kind of talk a little bit about how you see that, what the connection is between offering student choice and increasing student engagement? Yeah.
(0:05:02) So something I really want is for students to feel like they’re making the decisions in the classroom. I don’t want to just be the person that’s making all the decisions. Number one, as teachers, how many decisions do we make every single day and every single class period, right? Right. So choice is a powerful tool because it allows students to take control and ownership of their learning. They are making those decisions that impact their grades and their learnings.
(0:05:30) So when we talk about those tiered tasks, if a student chooses the most easiest choices on the choice board and then they wonder why they only achieved a B and not an A, I ask them, did you challenge yourself? How long did it take you to do this? Are you showing me critical thinking in these tasks?
(0:05:48) And then students can have the opportunity when, if there’s time to go and maybe add more to their assignment or to redo a part of the assignment or make a different decision. But I want them to know that the decisions that they make as a student impact something, their grades, their learning, things in the classroom. I don’t want it to just be me. And when you offer students choices,
(0:06:11) they’re more engaged because they’re getting to make the decision. It’s not me handing out an assignment and telling them you have to do this. It’s okay. We need to learn this skill. And I always say the government wants you to learn this because the government, you know, the government has decided that all sixth grade students need to learn X. And then I say, but you know, we can choose how we learn this topic. That’s great. Yeah. I love that when you’re providing students with the choice, then,
(0:06:39) They can take the ownership, like you were saying, because so many times I feel like my students think that school just happens to them, that they’re just this bystander of this thing called school. And so the more we can offer them choices and the more ownership that they take of that, then really not just the engagement, but the actual learning, I feel it takes place as well.
(0:07:01) Happy summer, ELA teachers. I hope you’re enjoying this summer series of interviews. As you gear up for the upcoming school year, are you as prepared as you’d like to be to address the unique needs of today’s students? The pandemic has left students with significant gaps in their education, highlighting the need for teachers to have the right tools at their disposal.
(0:07:20) Motivating Readers, Teaching in the Post-Pandemic Era is a book that provides practical ideas and suggestions from a teacher currently in the classroom. I’m sharing strategies that will help you individualize instruction for all students and create an environment where students can truly thrive. Motivating Readers will help you unlock your students’ potential and close the learning gaps. You can order your copy today from your favorite online retailer. Together, let’s ignite a love of reading in every student and pave the way for their future success.
(0:07:52) I know that when we talk about student choice and you were talking about choice boards, I know that many teachers feel like, oh, you’re talking about coming up with a million assignments for everything that we do. So can you share some examples of how you offer student choice without creating a million different assignments for everything?
(0:08:12) Okay, 100%. And I want to be 100% honest. I do not create five assignments for every skill, like if that’s not possible, but I want everyone to start small. So if the first thing or the only thing you take away from today is the best way to add choice in your classroom is to start small. So maybe you give students two options for a journal prompt, and then you can work your way up to offering choice on all major assignments.
(0:08:39) And we need to shift when we’re thinking about assessment in our classrooms. We can’t just assess on content. So it’s we need to go away from, OK, we all read the same short story. Now let’s answer 10 questions. Sure, there’s some of that. But where is the skill based learning? So what exactly are we assessing? Are we assessing grammar on this task?
(0:09:01) Are we assessing critical thinking? Is it paragraph structure? Because if we’re assessing paragraph structure, I’m just as happy for you to write me a paragraph about the video game that you love, as well as, you know, if I were writing the paragraph, it would be about why I love my cat. So I mean, whatever. And, you know, as a teacher, do you want to mark 30 of the exact same assignment? Like, what do you think, Carolyn? No, I absolutely do not. I hate when we have district prompts that are
(0:09:27) 100 essays on the same topic. No. So and what I mean is, if you’re assessing theme, how can students show that they know and understand theme from the novel in different ways? That way you’re not assessing 30 of the same thing. Do your assignments always have to be a paragraph or essay format?
(0:09:46) And start with the end in mind. So if you need your students to do something, think about, you’re not gonna create five or six assignments, but you might wanna have three choices as your final assignment. So if your final assignment
(0:10:00) is an essay, give them three prompts, or if they can make one a video, so it’s the exact same prompt for everybody. We’re gonna talk about the theme of the novel, but someone’s going to create a podcast, someone’s going to create a video, and someone’s going to create an essay. Now, this doesn’t work if your district says you 100% must, you know, assess the skill with an essay, then you would offer students choice of the prompt. So there’s, there’s a
(0:10:25) You know, choice is not a one size fits all. It’s what works for the teacher and what works for their classroom. Right. Absolutely. And sometimes the choice is going to be super small. You can read this short story or this short story. And that’s maybe the only choice that your district or your standard will allow you to give. And then other times you can have them choose between an essay or choose between a video or choose between a song or something else to demonstrate what they know. So it doesn’t have to be so big all the time.
(0:10:55) I think that anytime I can offer my students choice A or choice B, that just automatically has that buy-in. And then they’re like, oh yeah, I’ll do that for you, Ms. Wall. Sometimes I want teachers to think of the choice to be as simple as, do you want to complete this task independently or in pairs? So there’s your choice. You doesn’t have to be like even anything. Like, do you want to complete this independently or in pairs or groups or however your classroom is structured? Yeah.
(0:11:20) Or what about asking students, what writing surface do you want for today’s lesson? So do you want to do it on line paper, a Google Doc, or a whiteboard? Like, how do you want to practice what we’re learning? So imagine you’re working on grammar. Do you want to do it on line paper, a Google Doc, or a whiteboard? We’re all going to be practicing grammar today, but how are you going to, how do you want to work today? And there you go. You’ve offered your choice. Students can
(0:11:45) Students have the opportunity to choose. And then and you didn’t have to make 18 different grammar lessons for the day. I love that because they’re all going to have to do the same grammar, but yet they still have choice in how they are going, you know, the writing surface like you were talking about. It kind of goes back like when I do my independent reading. Do you want to sit at your desk or do you want to sit on the floor?
(0:12:06) even though they’re all still reading. That’s a great suggestion. All right. I feel like you’ve kind of answered our next question, but I’m still going to go ahead and ask it. And if you have anything you want to include, if somebody has never or rarely offered student choice, what advice would you give them? I heard you say start small. I just wanted to see if there was anything else you wanted to add about that question that we talked about. So I think I’ve already said this, but I just want to say it again because I think it’s so important.
(0:12:32) is it’s not 10 different options. Not like every single day in your classroom, you are not putting, you’re not the Oscars. You’re not a blockbuster movie. Can we even say blockbuster movie anymore? I don’t know. Does everyone know what blockbuster is? I miss blockbuster. But we’re not here to every single day offer 10 different choices. But if teachers can think about one small choice they can offer for the day, or if they can look at their assignment and say,
(0:13:02) Does it absolutely have to be done this way? And what about offering students the chance to propose how they want something done? So, you know, we’re coming to the end of the year now where I’m teaching. And I’m thinking, okay, I’ve covered a bunch of skills. So at this point, I could offer them a plethora of options, or I could say propose your own. And then as long as the student’s option that they’re proposing meets whatever you need to assess,
(0:13:31) There you go. You’ve offered choice, but you didn’t have to come up with that assignment. I love that because you’re never going to know your kids better than you do at the end of the year. And you know if they’re going to propose something that is reasonable that they can do or not. And yet that just continues to add that opportunity for them to take ownership of what they’re doing. All right. Tell us about one of your favorite projects or assignments that you use with your students that really highlights how offering student choice increases engagement.
(0:13:59) All right. So I’m going to tell you about two different assignments that I do to give teachers more ideas on what they could use in their classroom. And so one of the things is to help my students organize their independent reading. I have an independent reading journal format that I have them follow. And one of the things in the journal that they blew in at the beginning of the year is a checklist of genres.
(0:14:21) So my rule is I want you to read a variety of text. And it doesn’t matter to me what books they’re selecting as long as they’re age appropriate. And so for me, I ask them, OK, I say in my district, it’s a level three. So if you want to be then if you’re just reading like, you know, if you only choose one or two different genres throughout the year, maybe three, then that’s a B. But if you’re stretching your learning and you’re trying a bunch of different genres, then that’s an A in that particular criteria of the reading journal.
(0:14:51) Then I offer them a variety of journal responses. So I offer them for fiction and nonfiction, and they can reuse the journal prompt if it’s for a new book. So if it’s a new book and they really want to tell me something, but for that book, so if they’re on the same book for a month or six weeks, they can’t reuse that journal prompt. And then here’s how I add choice in when I really can’t add choice in.
(0:15:15) If there’s a skill that I absolutely need assessed because I have to either take it to like a PLC meeting or I need to take that skill and put on the report card, then maybe I only let them choose from two questions. I give them the questions that are 100% going to let me assess that skill, but they’re still getting choice because they can choose from question A or question B. Right. And you just narrowed down saying that.
(0:15:40) These are the choices today. I love that. And I love that you didn’t just say, well, we have to answer this question that you’re still giving them choice. I love that. All right. And what was your second project? Okay. So I want to talk about how I organize a choice board because sometimes I see choice boards online and they are so beautiful and they must take hours to put together.
(0:16:01) And I don’t know about you, but I don’t know where these extra hours come from, right? And I’ll be honest, the thought of a choice board is something that’s a little bit intimidating to me. I usually do the one or two choices, three choices, and that’s about it. So I’m excited to hear what you have to say. Okay, so in my district, my province where I teach, we need to assess reading and writing as well as media literacy skills and speaking and listening, but we call it like oral presentations. So there’s four components to our literacy program that we need to assess.
(0:16:31) When I’ve gone through a unit with a student, so a major unit, we’re talking four to six weeks, I try at the end to have a choice board that gives students choices for each of those categories. So for reading, for writing, for oral presentations and media literacy.
(0:16:47) And what happens is that way I if I’ve spent six weeks on a unit, I need to get all of those marks out of a unit because our report cards are broken down. It’s not just one mark for ELA, we have to give four marks. And so I, I offer students choices for reading. And that’s what I do my tiers. So I do like a high, medium and low option, or for writing, but I also make them
(0:17:11) the reading task might be very big, but the media literacy task might be a small task. So not all choices on choice boards are weighted equally depending on the assignment. Does that make sense? Yeah. I might ask them to draw the setting. I mean, maybe not for sixth grade, but I’m just trying to give an example. And then another student might, I don’t know, make the setting out of clay. Yet again, not for sixth grade, but I’m just trying to give an example, right? Sure, yeah.
(0:17:39) You know, but then for reading, they need to they need to, you know, write an essay on the theme. So then they’re having a combination of like fun tasks, you know, working and making a setting versus the essay task. So I think choice not only is about the skills, but also the fun level of an assignment. So, you know, what can we integrate into this assignment that is going to be fun, I hope, for students?
(0:18:05) Yeah, I love that. Whether they’re writing poetry or they’re doing something else like that. Absolutely. That’s great. Well, this last question is one that I ask all of the people that come on to the podcast. So we know that teaching is hard. It’s significantly changed in the last few years. What piece of advice would you give to a brand new teacher, maybe even just somebody who’s feeling a little burned out? What tip or teacher hack do you have for us?
(0:18:29) Okay, so I don’t know who invented this. It’s called the five by five rule. And my sister told me about it. And I try to remember it when things get challenging. And the big question to ask yourself is, will this matter in five years? So think about your career. And sure, some things are going to matter in five years. But then I break it down into, will this matter in five minutes, five hours, five days, five months, or five years?
(0:18:59) So last week or the week before I handed back a test and a few students felt that I was really hard on my marking and they felt they deserved one extra mark. I reread the question and I agreed with them. I, you know, it could have gone either way. It could have been, but the one mark, I was not going to argue about it. And so instead of making this a big thing and I didn’t want it to last five months and, you know,
(0:19:22) I just gave them the mark. And so and that’s not you can’t always do that. But it was a quiz. It wasn’t a major assessment. And I realized that maybe my marking scheme was a bit hard and it was one mark. So for teachers, think about this. When how long will this will this matter? Five hours, five days, five minutes, five months or five years?
(0:19:41) And I didn’t invent this. You can look it up. It’s called the five by five rule. That is awesome. I’ve never heard of that before. That is definitely something because I feel like sometimes in the day to day, something seems so big, but if you just step back, it’s really not the big deal that we’re feeling that it is in the moment. All right. Well, Christy, thank you
(0:20:00) so much for being here. If somebody would like to connect with you, where can they find you? So you can find me on my website, which is two peas and a dog.com. Or you can find me on social media at two peas and a dog. All right. And we will get all of those links in the show notes for people where they can just click on over and connect with you. Perfect. Thank you so much for having me today. Of course, anytime. And I’m sure that we’ll be in a collaboration soon again. Perfect. Thank you.
(0:20:29) What a great conversation with Christy. I love her passion for providing choices for students. Choice is one of the biggest ways to get buy-in from students and increase student engagement. Christy provided some great examples about how choice can be as simple as giving two journal prompts or allowing students to choose whether to do
(0:20:48) a task with a partner, or independently. It’s not always possible or even necessary to give multiple assignment options, but try to find ways within your assignment to give students choices. Choices about giving the student a say in their own education and giving them a voice in your classroom.
(0:21:07) All of these little opportunities for choice will help increase their motivation and their engagement. If you would like to connect with Christy, I’ll put her links over in the show notes, but be sure to check out her blog, Two Peas and a Dog. This week in the Secondary ELA Facebook group, we’ll be brainstorming ideas on how you can incorporate more choices in your class. If you haven’t joined the group yet, please look for the link over in the show notes. Next week, my sweet friend Jennifer from Books, Babbles and Bows will be joining us.
(0:21:36) I’m excited to chat with her about holding students accountable for reading. I’ve known Jen for a few years. She’s a collaborator on ELA Matters, my collaborative blog, and I know that you’re just going to love her. All right, everyone. Thank you so much for listening today. Keep enjoying your summer and until next time, have a great week.